Adventure ahead! By now, you’ve heard that Cub Scouting got a big upgrade in 2015. We’ve got your road map to the “new” Cub Scouting program, including what changed (and what didn’t change), the new adventure loops and more details on how the BSA made advancement requirements more achievable with updated requirements in 2016.
The Cub Scout motto is “Do Your Best,” but maybe it should be “Embrace Change.” Since Cub Scouting began in 1930, the program has changed frequently. Age limits have dropped. Tigers have been introduced. Lions have gone extinct. The Webelos Scout program has appeared and expanded. Den mothers have become den leaders, and men and women now serve as Cubmasters. But perhaps the biggest changes lie ahead. Effective June 1, 2015, the BSA made sweeping changes to Cub Scouting — changes that promise to help make the program more fun and engaging.
The Path to Change
In some organizations, strategic plans are little more than expensive paperweights and dust collectors. Not so in the BSA. The 2011-2015 National Council Strategic Plan laid out more than 100 goals designed to make Scouting’s second century as successful as its first. Perhaps the most important of those goals was to update our programs to “reflect the findings of a thorough program review and assessment that clearly identifies those elements that are appealing, exciting and culturally relevant to today’s youth and families.” Dubbed “goal 411” — because it was the first goal of the first objective of the plan’s fourth pillar — this goal has led to sweeping changes to the Cub Scout program. Here’s the path from there to here.
2010-2011: Under the leadership of Utah volunteer Russ Hunsaker, a task force of roughly 75 volunteers from across the country evaluated how well Cub Scouting was addressing five desired outcomes: character development, participatory citizenship, personal fitness, outdoor skills and awareness, and leadership development. The report card was mixed. Cub Scouting offered plenty of fun, but there weren’t enough connections between the program and the desired outcomes. There was too much passive learning and too few tools for den leaders.
2012-2013: The 14-member Cub Adventure Team, led by volunteers Nancy Farrell from Colorado and Ken King from Illinois, began building a revised Cub Scout program around the desired outcomes. The team, which included active Cub Scout leaders with special expertise in education, curriculum design and Scout-leader training, overhauled the advancement program. Separately, in October 2012, the National Executive Board approved a resolution to use the Scout Oath and Scout Law across all programs.
2013: Den leaders in 11 councils across the country tested the new advancement program, offering feedback that the Cub Adventure Team incorporated in its final product. The team continued tweaking the program and wrote new youth handbooks and den leader guides.
2014: Sessions at the National Annual Meeting and the Philmont Training Center (PTC) let volunteers give the revised program a test drive. More than 230 Cub Scouters attended six PTC sessions over the summer. Participants received booklets that included sample chapters from the new youth and adult publications. Additional feedback led to a final set of requirements in September.
2015: New publications and awards began appearing in Scout shops ahead of the official June 1 launch of the revised program.
2016: The BSA announced modifications to the newly released program to make it more flexible for busy parents, den leaders and Cubmasters.
What’s Not Changing?
At one point, rumors flew around the Internet that the Cub Scout uniform was changing. It’s not.
In fact, most things about Cub Scouting are staying the same, including den and pack structures, age and gender requirements, and the emphasis on fun and doing your best.
Cub Scouting will now have seven methods: Living the Ideals (which incorporates the former Making Character Connections method), Belonging to a Den, Using Advancement, Involving Family and Home, Participating in Activities, Serving Home and Neighborhood, and Wearing the Uniform.
All that’s really changing is how the ideals and advancement methods are implemented.
Updated Ideals
Cub Scouting has come a long way from the 1930s, when Cub Scouts pledged to be “square” (considered a good thing at the time!). Back then, the Cub Scout Promise simply read, “I, [name], promise to do my best to be square and to obey the Law of the Pack.” As part of the revised Cub Scout program, the Cub Scout Promise and the Law of the Pack have been retired, and boys will now learn the Scout Oath and Scout Law. This change emphasizes the unity of the Scouting movement and makes it a bit easier for Cub Scouting to live out Scouting’s mission and vision statements, both of which refer to the Scout Oath and Scout Law. The Cub Scout motto, sign, salute and handshake are not changing. 
What’s an Adventure?
Perhaps the most important word in the revised Cub Scout program is “adventure.” In Cub Scout terms, an adventure is a collection of themed, multidisciplinary activities representing enough engaging content for three den meetings and one pack meeting — about a month’s worth of programming, in other words.
The word “adventure” emphasizes that Cub Scout activities should be fun and should take boys places they’ve never been. The adventures focus on learning by doing instead of learning by listening. Requirements are full of words like build, play, go, find, demonstrate and discover, not words like discuss, learn and share.
The Tiger, Wolf and Bear books contain 19 adventures each, while the Webelos Handbook (which covers two years) contains 27. That means there will be plenty of material for year-round fun, even in the Arrow of Light year.
The Academics and Sports Program
Cub Scouts have been earning belt loops for individual and team sports since 1985 and for academic subjects since 1991, and it’s no doubt they enjoyed the bling. Often, however, earning belt loops detracted from the advancement program as some boys (and leaders) focused on easy belt loops over more challenging — and meaningful — achievements.
With the introduction of the new advancement program, the Academics and Sports Program has been retired. However, many of its best elements have been incorporated into the new adventures, and the new adventure loops ensure that boys’ belts will be as jangly as ever.
Advancement
The old advancement program included a dizzying array of beads, badges, belt loops, arrow points, compass points and activity pins.
Now, each rank will follow the same format. To earn a rank, a boy must complete a mix of seven required and elective adventures.
New Cub Scouts will continue to earn the Bobcat badge before working on other requirements. To earn Bobcat, boys must learn about the Scout Oath and Scout Law and the Cub Scout sign, handshake, motto and salute; they must also complete the exercises described in the pamphlet How to Protect Your Children From Child Abuse: A Parent’s Guide.
Boys receive an adventure loop (previously called belt loops) for each adventure at the Tiger, Wolf and Bear levels, and an adventure pin (worn on the Webelos colors or Webelos cap) for each adventure at the Webelos and Arrow of Light ranks. The recognition items for required adventures are full-color, while the ones for elective adventures are monochromatic. Once a boy completes seven adventures for a given rank, he receives the pocket patch.
To maintain consistency across ranks, boys entering the program in the fifth grade no longer must earn the Webelos badge as a prerequisite for Arrow of Light.
Edited in 2016: The BSA learned that some den leaders had difficulty fitting into their program year all of the adventures required for advancement. This resulted in boys not advancing. After a careful review, the BSA made some adventure requirements optional that previously were mandatory — a move intended to give Cub Scouters more control over their den programs.
Here’s what you need to know about the modifications announced in November 2016 include:
- You won’t need to buy any new materials. The new requirements are posted in a free addendum available at scouting.org/programupdates. This will supplement the handbooks in current circulation and for sale online and in Scout shops.
- The number of new Cub Scouts is up in many areas of the country, but rank advancement rates have not kept pace, meaning the BSA’s team of volunteers and staff advisors wanted to react quickly to eliminate a potential roadblock.
- The modifications are designed to ensure adventure requirements are achievable by today’s Cub Scout dens within a program year. This means they are achievable by all Cub Scouts, regardless of background or socioeconomic status.
- Most of the modifications involve the number of requirements that must be completed, reducing the mandate to a number achievable within the limited time available to many dens.
- The changes increase den-level customization. Units that can handle more content, perhaps because they meet more often or for longer periods, can — and should — keep the optional requirements part of their programs. On the other hand, those that have struggled to finish the requirements will welcome these changes as a way to meet their needs.
- With the modifications, dens should be able to complete one adventure in approximately two den meetings.
- During this program year, a den may choose to continue with the previous adventure requirements or to use the modifications for some or all of its adventures.
- Scoutbook, the BSA’s official web app for tracking Scout advancement, is being updated to reflect the new requirements.
See all the modified requirements and more details at scouting.org/programupdates
Introducing Ethan
Boys are aspirational by nature. They long to become like their big brothers, their older cousins, and the kids who are a grade or two ahead of them in school.
Starting this year, many Cub Scouts will aspire to be Ethan.
Ethan is a new character who appears in all four Cub Scout handbooks and speaks directly to the reader about what he’s been doing in Scouting. In each handbook, Ethan is a year or two older than the boys he’s addressing. (In the Tiger Handbook, he’s a Wolf, while in the Webelos Handbook, he’s a Boy Scout.)
Ethan introduces each of the required adventures, shares tips from his own experiences and previews what boys can look forward to as they progress in Scouting. While Ethan is a good Scout, he’s not a perfect one. He struggles to master the square knot, he gets scared by a spooky ghost story, and he forgets the jelly for PB&J sandwiches. But he always has fun and is always ready for his next adventure.
New for 2015: Den Leader Guides
The revised program comes complete with four printed den leader guides that complement the youth handbooks. More comprehensive than the old Den & Pack Meeting Resource Guide, these books offer the following resources for each adventure:
- The rationale for the adventure
- Takeaways for Cub Scouts (learning objectives)
- A list of the adventure requirements
- Planning and implementation notes
- Detailed meeting plans (including supply lists and handouts)
Meeting preparation should be easier because the guides are self-contained — there’s no need to search through other publications for games or song lyrics, for example. Leaders who pilot-tested the adventures found that it took them about 45 minutes to prepare for an hourlong meeting.
What About Akela?
In the revised Cub Scout program, Akela will still be a special term for any leader, and the Cub Scout sign will still resemble the attentive ears of a wolf. Cub Scouting’s use of characters from The Jungle Book will be mentioned in the youth handbooks but, beyond that, the TC, Akela and Baloo characters won’t show up. (Keep in mind that The Jungle Book was published in 1894 and that most people’s frame of reference is the Disney movie that came out 48 years ago.)
Back to the Future
As the first Wolf handbook proclaimed, Cub Scouting was born at a time of adventure: “where we read in the morning papers what was done at the South Pole yesterday — where music and speech circle the globe ‘on the air’ — where airplanes wing their swift flight.”
The adventure has only increased in the ensuing 85 years, but the hope described in that long-ago book remains the same: that Cub Scouts “find fun and joy in doing and … give back to the world a life useful and worthy.”
The revised Cub Scout program promises to make that hope a reality for millions of boys.
Find new Cub Scout handbooks, den leader guides and uniform accessories in Scout shops as of May 1 or at ScoutStuff.org
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how does shooting sports fit in with the new program?
Shooting sports remains a fun program feature for Cub Scouts, delivered at council and district operated events.
A new shooting sports recognition program will be released in Fall 2015 through the National Camping School system.
In the meantime, local council and district camps may use the remaining inventory of the academic and sports program belt loops and pins, or may devise another local council recognition.
Or – know that boys will have a great time shooting, even without an official recognition – they will just have fun!
When a Scout moves from one rank to the next (for example from Wolf to Bear) do they stop wearing the Adventure Loops for Wolf or would they continue to wear Adventure Loops from previous years?
They can continue wearing the Adventure Loops. You’ll find answers to similar questions like this at http://www.scouting.org/filestore/program_update/pdf/Cub%20Adventure%20Program%20FAQs.pdf.
When will the new leader books be available?
The Den Leader Guide is scheduled to be released May 1 or sooner. For updates, visit blog.scoutingmagazine.org.
Find Den Leader Guides, the new handbooks and accessories at your local Scout Shop or at ScoutStuff.org.
Received mine in the mail today and I like what I see.
OK, so we have the leadaer’s books. but when does the on-line training get updated? As of yesterday, it is not, and I have brand-new den leaders who are starting meetings in three weeks. They really need training in the “New Program”.
DeLane, great question. The Scouting U team will launch the new training for Cub Scouting leaders by the end of the month. Please stay tuned to my.scouting.org to access the training as soon as it’s available. —Gretchen
Hi, DeLane. Read more about the release of Cub Scouting leader training here: http://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2015/09/08/new-cub-scout-leader-training-available-scouting-org/
Boys are welcome to wear all of their previously earned adventure loops ( and for boys who earned academic and sports loops, they may continue to wear those as well) on their belts.
The new leader guides will be available on May 1 as well.
I’m still waiting for a good explanation for dropping the Cub Scout Promise and the Law of the Pack. It’s caused a great deal of confusion in our Pack and I personally feel like the Scout Law is above the age of our boys, especially the Tigers and Wolves.
I appreciate the idea of unifying the Scouting programs and giving them more continuity, but I too am concerned that incoming Tigers & Wolves will have difficulty meeting the requirements to earn their Bobcat Rank. The Scout Law & Scout Oath were difficult for my 4th grade Webelos to learn and can’t imagine a 1st & 2nd grader accomplishing this in a reasonable time period. I know how proud the boys were at that age to achieve their Bobcat Rank and to delay receiving this because of the difficulty in memorizing the Scout Oath & Law would be a shame.
We have a board made up and from the get go we teach all scouts this. We might use it as an opening or a closing or your older boys can teach the new boys.
Coming from a mother who married an Eagle Scout and have 4 sons who are Eagle Scouts I feel that these changes are going to make it more like school than an learning to enjoy the experiences of the great outdoors. I think young boys who struggle in school will fall out. Stop trying to change something that has worked to something that may draw more money an lazy adults. Sorry I just hate seeing all the changes.
But the requirement is to _learn_ and understand the oath and law, not to memorize it. I agree memorizing the entire oath and law would be a lot to ask of your average or below-average 6-year-old. But please read the requirements carefully – don’t confuse “understand” with “memorize and be able to explain.”
From my understanding the Scout Law and Scout Oath requirement for Bobcat has “with help if needed” after those items. So for younger scouts it having them “repeat after me” should work.
Remember Cub Scouting is a participation thing. Mastery is not required. As long as they are participating it is good enough. If they can progress to mastering the concepts… Totally awesome! But don’t get bogged down with every I dotted and T crossed at this point.
“Repeat after me” is okay? Are you kidding me right now? My Tigers memorized the Cub law and promise and understood it. This change is ridiculous.
As a Den Leader and a Boy Scout Leader I find myself mixing up the two during Cub Scout events and stumbling over the words, I have the Boy Scout Oath and Law etched into my head since I was a young boy and still remember it to this day I don’t remember the Cub Oath and Law from when I was a Cub. I don’t see any reason why we shouldn’t teach the young ones the Oath and Law of the Boy Scouts then they know it for when they crossover and it unifies the two groups so if there is ever a combined event they can all participate in saying the Oath and Law together. I taught my Son by having him repeat it every night before bed for one week and then he remembered it, now we can spend a little time each Den Meeting learning what each word means.
I think the change to unify Cubs and Boy Scouts by both using the Scout Law and Oath is a great move forward. All changes are inconvenient, but I do see this as an inspired change. As others have mentioned, Bobcats can do this “with help as needed” which leaves it open to being given as much help “as needed” for each boy. They are NOT required to memorize it completely, but repeating it several times until they can say it fluently with help is a great start. Over the next 3-5 years that they spend in cub scouts, they’ll get it! And they will go into Scouts knowing what’s expected of them as young men.
If they can learn the Pledge of Allegiance, they can learn the Scout Oath and the Scout Law. Children are much more flexible than many adults. They seem to embrace the change much faster than us.
The Cub Scout Promise & Law of the Pack should not have been retired. The Cubs deserve their own “Promise” as does the Scouts
Do you have confirmation on “May 1st or sooner” for the new books? Seems like with only a week to go there should be more advertising and information about their availability and release date.
In the Tiger requirements: “With your den, make a den job chart that shows everyone doing something to help. As one of the den jobs, lead the Pledge of Allegiance at a den meeting.”
The next time the Scouts have anything to do with the American Flag is at the Bear level: “Learn about our flag. Display it at home for one month. Say the Pledge of Allegiance and learn its meaning.”
Just display it – REALLY!
Then the next time they have anything to do with the American Flag is during the AOL time: “Explain the history of the United States flag. Show how to properly display the flag in public, and help lead a flag ceremony.”
Tiger, Bear, AOL…..what happened to learning to conduct a ceremony, proper display, what to do when the flag passes by with Wolf and Webelos?
The Scout Oath, “On my Honor…duty to God and my country….” we are getting away from the basic core of Scouting as American Citizens. Oh yes, God is through out the program – this is good, but, what about the symbol of this country – the American Flag, it’s history, symbolism, the men and women who have died defending it and freedom. You are getting away from the ideals of America when you take the flag out of the program and just dot it sporadically in the requirements. Wish there were a way to ask Baden Powell for his opinion regarding the current thinking and lack of Honor to one’s country through this new program…..
I am so glad that my pack is not the only one that has an issue with this!!!!!
Now that we have strated using the new requirements (we do a summer program) this is one of the things we have gotten the most comments about.
The others? new religious requirements and camping. Our pack may actually lose members over some of the changes.
I left more detailed comments in the forum section
I believe this program is too specific. I’m trying to plan out a Cub/Boy Scout Camporee for our District. The requirements are so stringent that there is no room for creativity. Once you’ve been a leader, you know that leaders have some of the most innovative and creative ways to teach the kids about their requirements. Instead of writing bounce an inflated ball and roll a tire fully inflated versus partially deflated they could of allowed for creativity. They literally wrote out the science experiments. Did they ever think there might be science teachers, electricians, and leaders who take the initiative to invite guests in? But the way the books are written the boys won’t get credit without completing the adventures/experiments as is. Why???
That to me is unimaginative and narrow minded. The creativity I’ve seen in leadership has been phenomenal. I see leaders who go above and beyond. And now my District program will be stagnate after one or two years because the kids at these events go to stations even if it’s not for their rank (because it’s fun). But we won’t be able to offer much variety in future years AND offer completion of adventures. It’s an unfair program to not allow for the simple statement “such as”.
I can’t agree with you more. Unfortunately most leaders are parents with some it no education beyond high school. They want everything spelled out for them. Heaven help them if they have to innovate. The program was written so that the scared parent and leader who doesn’t want to go the extra mile can feel like they are accomplishing something.
I must respectfully disagree. The quality of the scouting program will continue to rest where it always has. On the strength and quality of the leaders who volunteer their time. I’m an Eagle Scout who started cub scouting the year before tiger cubs became an option and now my son is finishing his tiger cub year. I like the continuity of using the Scout Oath and Law all the way thru. I like most of what I’m hearing about the new program and how belt loops have changed to make the program more cohesive in the cub scout ranks. Is the new program perfect? No, but neither is the current program. Good Leaders will still be able to help their packs and dens to have a positive scouting experience. Hopefully, this new program will help leaders that aren’t as good to be better leaders. I understand why you might be concerned that its too restrictive and that it could drive more independent leaders away from the program, but in all honesty, the more independent leaders are more important at the boy scout level anyway.
Bryan your creative and innovative Cub leaders become your best Boy Scout leaders. Plus their inspiring programs is what increases retention rates. This is exactly where Troops draw their membership from as most do not actually recruit in schools. JMHO
Restricting creativity and innovation is akin to cutting a birds wings. I’m all for creating a program with firmer goals and a more clear vision for your newest or uninspired leaders. But restricting it in such a way that your most dedicated and creative leaders can’t perform is a mistake. Your most active leaders/ Districts/ Councils will complain if not right away within the first year or two, I guarantee.
Really, lack of higher education doesn’t equal lack of creativity. I have met many, many leaders in my area that finished high school that were some of the most creative and innovative leaders I’ve seen in Scouting, far surpassing myself, and I have an Masters degree.
Well that is just not what I have experienced and observed. I am glad you have seen it but I just have not.
One way to look at this: the requirements for the rank are spelled out and the dens should be able to do them on their own. Thus the district and council events can go above and beyond to teach and give experience in a range of activities that stretch this understanding, introduce new concepts, and really engage them to have fun.
There has, in my opinion, been way too much “come to this event, your boy will get x, y, and z done”. This should not be the selling point, and rarely is it the reason the person organizing it is interested in organizing it (again from my experience.)
Maybe this is an opportunity to break free from that cycle, and really be able to do more with the boys.
With having worked with the book over the summer within our summer program, there are times it is nice it is spelled out. Other times it is great to see what they suggest and then change it to work with what you have. I do not own spare truck or car tires, but i understand what they want to show so I can use materials that I have available. These activities are not Eagle required merit badges. Some times with a unit do one item, such as a pack campout. If you read all the requirements and do , for example, the webelos or AOL campfire requirement and involve all cubs there, they will all do the requirement.
For the Boy Scout/Cub Scout Camporee being planned, is it for all Cub Scouts? I have a hard time seeing my troop doing a camporee weekend with Tiger Cubs. We always only invite Webelos and they must be camping as guests of a Boy Scout troop. They are invited to spend Saturday even if they are not spending the night.
Due to Guide to Safe Scouting, many activities cannot be done by Cubs that are allowed for Boy Scouts.
My boys do not like wearing belts. It there any other way to wear their “adventure loops”?
After helping my 4 oldest sons through the current cub scout program, I have a great love for Cub Scouting. We display their awards openly in our home. I’m worried that my 3 younger sons won’t have the same amount of awards to display and will feel like they didn’t work as hard as the older boys (who earned a lot of arrow points and all of the achievement pins in Webelos, as well as patches for things like the Outdoor Code.) Boys feel competitive, whether or not adults want them to and I’m afraid that in my home this might be a cause for contention.
The new program might be easier for uncreative and new leaders, but it seems unfair for those of us who have been in the program longer and are willing to work hard to teach our boys the many skills Cub Scouting offers.
The new program has taken the creativity and individualism out of the program
Meritbadge.org has the outlines listed for the new programs on their rank requirements pages. The Adventures are just the beginning, there are numerous electives in each rank that cover many of the items in the old programs. I’m transitioning out of our Pack as Cubmaster for 2 years and Den leader for 3 and I’m sort of jealous of the Den leaders behind me getting to take the boys through this new program. Sure there will be some growing pains but I think the boys will get more out of it as it goes along.
I remember trying to get my Tiger, Wolf and Bear dens through the required activities to meet rank. Because folks in my community have other activities in addition to Scouting they participate in I would only get about 15-17 Den meetings per scouting year because of Pack meetings and other Pack events taking up meeting time. We would only have enough Den meetings to get through the requirements and would have time to work the electives. With this program I could probably finish the rank requirements from Sept – Dec and have from Jan – June to work on electives. I would have the Boys pick the electives they wanted to do which would give them control over their scouting experience.
Dave, I don’t think you fully appreciate how in depth each Adventure trail is. They are not meant to be completed in one meeting. If that is what you are planning, you will be disappointed. The requirements are very in depth, much more so than the prior program.
I have a copy of the requirements which I will attach for those who haven’t seen it.
http://www.scouting.org/filestore/program_update/pdf/Appended%20Requirements.pdf
For instance from the Tiger program
Tiger Adventure: Games Tigers Play
1. Do the following:
a. Play two initiative or team-building games with the members of your den.
b. Listen carefully to your leader while the rules are being explained, and follow
directions when playing.
c. At the end of the game, talk with the leader about what you learned when you
played the game. Tell how you helped the den by playing your part.
2. Make up a game with the members of your den.
3. Make up a new game, and play it with your family or members of your den or pack.
4. Find out how being active is part of being healthy. While at a sporting event, ask a player or
coach why he or she thinks it is important to be active.
5. Bring a nutritious snack to a den meeting. Share why you picked it and what makes it a good
snack choice.
This one requirement encompasses several events. A day of play, possibly a game at camp out or other pack/ den activity, a sporting event, and each boy bringing in snacks (is it a snack meeting or each boy volunteers over the course of many meetings likely depends on the den leader’s preference). This is just a Tiger achievement.
I’m not against this approach but it makes the instant recognition for the youngest boys harder. Especially now that belt loops are gone. Even the elective trails are harder to earn.
My point is that I don’t think you can bank on being done by December unless you are working those boys outrageously hard which might drive them from the program especially if they do other activities or clubs. JMO
So I was momentarily excited by the “being done by December” possibility, and then here comes the “how in depth the new program is.” Here’s the reality of the situation for our pack. Like Dave, my kids have very busy lives in a small town and we’re competing with many other activities. I have my den leaders hit their rank advancements by the end of January so we can advance at Blue & Gold in February and then spend the rest of February, March and April on fun electives (arrow points and/or belt loops). Our Scout year ends April 30 because little league and other summer programs take over our kids’ lives. We don’t need “more in depth;” we’re getting along just fine.
I do appreciate it, but for each rank there is no requirement that every adventure has to be done in Pack meetings. There are still items that parents can work with their scout at home. That’s the way I’ve run my Dens. Go through the list of all requirement and determine which will be done in Den meetings and which will be done at home ,put those on a schedule and provide to families at the beginning of the scout year. I feel that having parents work with their scouts at home (and before you say parents will just say they did those items, in my experience, the boys keep the parent pretty honest about it) helps to get the parents more involved, which for cub scouting is paramount to having a successful Pack.
I hope that those of you who think that scouts is something to hurry through and finish up so that you can move on, are letting parents who are interested in joining your packs know that is how you roll. I grew up with brothers who were in a very active year round pack and I’ve been very disappointed with the lackluster leadership that I have encountered in the leaders of my son’s dens. It’s clear that they want the title but they aren’t interested in doing their “best” or giving the boys the experience that they deserve. And yes I have volunteered to help in any way that I can on many occasions. Getting ready to switch packs again, hopefully this time for one where the den leader feel that the boys deserve more. There are a lot of things that I don’t like about the new program but if it forces den leaders to have meetings more than once (or rarely twice) a month with the sole purpose of finishing the minimum requirements so that they can move onto other things, then I think that part is great. Because so far while my son has gotten a good pack experience as a Tiger and a Wolf, both his den leaders should have stepped back and let someone else have the job.
Will there be something for small packs with 5 or so boys of mixed ranks? Similar to Mixed Den Meeting Plan options from the Guide or Alternative Cub Scout Delivery Manuals? Leaders of these small packs need all the help they can get to try and make the unit grow. What can we do to help them?
My case too!!
Any suggestion, will be gladly appreciated!!!
I have some recruitment ideas that worked to grow my pack. Please email pack78cubscouts@yahoo.com.
I read through the new program ( but did not study it in-depth) and also all the posted comments. I know the new program was piloted around the country. I am wondering if, after a couple years, the BSA plans to review implementation and make changes/ adjustments if needed, after all units have been using the new requirements? And will there be some way for units to provide systematic feedback about what is and is not working? Remember, this was tested and revised with a certain number of units before it was rolled out, and the changes were thought-out over a long period of time.
So if the program is changing, will national offer a buy back or trade in for units with excess stock? WHY is national still selling the old stock in stores at face value and not reducing it to move it off shelves? My unit has has about 2 dozen of each webelos pins and beltloops we cannot keep track of. No we have to go buy all new pins and loops? I think national should let us trade them in no-questions-asked then. Just another hour a week, huh?
Our Scout Shop bought back our Webelos Pin and Belt Loops.
Really any problems? I have about 100 loops and 400 pins, LOL!
“Keep in mind that The Jungle Book was published in 1894 and that most people’s frame of reference is the Disney movie that came out 48 years ago.” It’s a shame that the classics are not taught or required reading. Many are a lot better than the “new” literature that is being produced. 🙁
My disappointment comes in the boys not earning beads for rank. There are those boys who were Wolves this year and earned their progress beads, now their “progress to rank” is going to be incomplete in a way. These guys have no chance of continuing to earn the beads and also no arrows. I think they should have left it as a transition like they are doing with the webelos/arrow of light. The leaders/scouts should have been given the option to continue and finish the “old program” for bear rank. The beads and arrows were a showing to those around the scout what they had accomplished. I know they get the new loops but it looks like there is so much involved it will be a lot harder/longer between finishing the achievements.
Christine, This is where the Den Doodle will be very helpful. You can put a bead or whatever you choose onto the doodle each time your Cub Scout does something.You can even have attendance beads, activity beads, special event beads. Jus bed sure you have a list so everyone knows what they can earn! And, just like adults, boys love to earn all those beads.
The bead comment is not mine That is actually one of the things I will not miss.
My concerns are the diminished emphasis on citizenship, Camping requirements that are not universal (..it is only required IF your charter organization allows it. No other activity says that. What if my charter organization does not allow singing or carnivals?) I have parents that will not camp and will probably quit. Parents that feel that the religious requirements are intrusive. We have always done a summer program as a pack and it is really hard to have everyone earn something when the ages are mixed.
So what were the “desired outcomes” this panel was trying to achieve? Maybe the changes would make more sense if we could see the big picture……..
We are now being told that the new program insists that the pack leaders only let Webelo scouts to visit the troop that corresponds to the pack or charter. In the past BSA had a position of no feeder packs, and wanted units to work together, and Cub scouts to visit two or three troops to find one that suites them. I have read the out line and it says to just visit a troop. The 2015-2016 Roundtable guide says to train leaders to still work together, and that the cubs should still visit more then one troop. What is the BSA policies on Cub to Scout guidelines?
Even Scouting Magazine recently had an article that discussed the importance of visiting several troops. I think that is important. BSA can’t “make” cub scouts join a particular troop.
Gender requirements? explain.
No Akela? Now it’s Ethan? Sounds like another change for the need for change. Hard to build a “time-honored” tradition if it changes every year or two.
You are so right, Sam! Dads that were scouts are disappointed to find out how much the program has changed!
I don’t understand where all the anger and disappointment with the new program is coming from. I have started using the new requirements and couldn’t be happier. The arrow points would get lost or parents failed to sew them on. Beads would come loose and get lost. Scouts don’t lose belt loops and can instantly out them on their informs. The books are better written for the age groups. Under the old system the younger scouts could not make heads or tails of the requirements. My son picked up the new bears book and started using it like a workbook. He came up to me explaining the that we need to go to the grocery store for one part of an elective. Winner!!
Thank god BSA removed the cub law and promise. One law and oath for all three age programs. Cubs/Scouts/ventures. It makes sense in the long run.
I don’t like how they shortened the webelos program. Moving cub scouts over to boy scouts in the 5th grade is not good. The Boy Scout program is about individual responsibility and independence. 5th graders need too much guidance. They are not mature enough.
I respectfully suggest that they should have retained the Arrows Points. Just decrease the number awarded. Once a youth has earned the Tiger, Wolf, and/or Bear rank and starts working on the elective adventure loops, award him a Gold Arrow Point for completing 6 elective adventure loops and a Silver for completing all of the remaining ones. (i.e. 1 Gold and 1 Silver Arrow Point per rank.) That way, at least until they earn Webelos, they have something to show that they just didn’t wear the min. Because, each yr, the belt loops come off as they start the next rank. Plus, we still retain some of our Cub Scout tradition while still embracing the new program up dates. Sometime old with something new. 😉
When my son was in cub scouts, we were not a feeder pack so we went to at least four troops to check them out. The new Webelos/AOL adventures do not state what troop you have to visit. Your pack can go where and when they want. If your district/council has Round Table, you should go to it. The new adventures actually make the relationship stronger between troops and packs (not just feeders, all) because they want more interactions happening. Remember, even if you are a “feeder pack”, that Troop may not be for your son.
I purchased one of each new award for a display we are building for recruiting. The cost, $26.41 per Scout for each rank, Tiger, Wolf and Bear. Webelos core was $9.45 per Scout and Arrow of Light core was $7.56 per Scout with Webelos electives at $34.02 per Scout. Most of our Scouts earn every award available.
These costs are only for belt loops and Webelos pins and did not include ranks or books (at $12.99 per book). This is a huge budget increase, particularly for the younger Scouts and it will be reflected in upcoming dues. How many families will not join the program simply because of the cost?
We are in competition with many alternate programs. If families are faced with multiple fundraisers, they will look elsewhere too.
We no longer have to keep records and don’t really need an advancement chairman, and will have very little to recognize at Pack meetings (because we won’t know who earned what except once a year for ranks). Do we even need a pack meeting because all this is done in the den meeting. No incentive to come to a pack meeting if we are not receiving awards there.
Recruiting new members should be our emphasis at the beginning of each year and that is going to be hard to do with so much money needing to be raised. Are we in the business of raising money or in the business of providing a good boy program?
@Heather J
As critical as I am of upcoming changes. The costs I semi expected. I think they’ve eliminated the problem of an entire pack earning belt loop(s) at once. This can offset slightly more expensive rank based awards. Our pack has paid for every BL, award, & rank badge straight out of popcorn fundraising for years and we have 60 plus active scouts. We easily spend anywhere between $1200 – $1700 a year depending on number of active Webelos and Arrow of Light Scouts.
Fundraising is part of scouting if it’s not than there are out of pocket expenses. Period – the program changes didn’t change that. We also pay our leader fees, campsite fees, and fund either a Blue & Gold orChristmas Party. Last year we were well enough off after two additional fundraisers (pancake bfast, & restaurant fundraiser same day as pinewood derby) that we also saved money for a new derby track and had enough left over to pay for food on a weekend camp out too.
Fundraising has a purpose that helps everyone. People will drop $50, $75, $150 to sign kids up to other sports teams or activities. They are expected to fundraise. Why should we expect less. We are volunteers not magicians. We need money to implement the program their children are deserving of. In our case, we utilize scout accounts so the boys who do the most fundraising reap the greatest reward. But the pack and thus everyone can win out sometimes and certainly for the awards they certainly do.
Does anyone know when cub scout leader specific training will be offered on-line? I’m trying to get all my leaders trained for the next den level that started June 1st but there’s nothing available. Taking the current training appears to be a waste since the new leader training should discuss advancement.
Great question, Debbie. The folks at Scouting U have redesigned the Cub Scout leader-specific training based on the new Cub Scouting program. This training will be available early August on my.scouting.org. Look for a special feature story on the new training for all leaders in the September-October issue of Scouting, hitting mailboxes around August 20th.
I am wondering if there is a chart available that compares similar adventures for each den so that our dens can plan den meetings and go on the “field trip together”. We have small dens and meet together. Any help would be great! Thanks!
This is a great question. We hope to achieve the same thing
I would love to have some input and help.
My son finishes his Wolf this month. He has a very busy schedule all year and hasn’t made it to many meetings. He also had a leader that never kept up on him unless I called them.
He therefore hasn’t received his beads, arrows, etc for wolves. The cub master told him at the last pack meeting that he couldn’t get him the awards. This is a horrible way to get a child to desire to do more when he can’t get the awards for what he has done.
Is their no correlation for the achievements->adventures for the kids going out to get their awards?
Hi Lesa,
If he just completed his Wolf it must’ve been under the old program that completed on June 1st. Now the new program (Adventures) are going to be a bit more involved to complete one requirement to earn a single Adventure with there being seven Adventures required for each rank in order to Advance. There are required Adventures and Elective Adventures for each rank. For Bear he will need to complete 6 required and one elective AdventureJust as with the old program, if a child is absent he can complete an activity at home. Just know that some are more involved than in the past. Typically one Adventure is anticipated to take 3-4 meetings.
Perhaps there are Adventure Loop fairs in your area once or twice a year you could consider looking into if scheduling is an issue? Or perhaps even another Pack. You should never allow a meeting night conflict or issue with with his leader deter your son’s pursuit with scouts. I would say the same thing with a scout in my own Pack. First, I would discuss your concerns with his leader and Cubmaster to see if your concerns are addressed though. It’s funny how some leaders don’t realize just how much parents and boys really want to be involved but just can’t be for one reason or another.
Best of luck to you and your son in his Scouting pursuits!
I have no idea what some leaders are thinking. But I will be very upset if my son doesn’t get his awards from his current pack. I submitted them last year before the old program ended but when we went to the final meeting he didn’t get most of them. His den leader claimed that I sent the list too late. I sent it the day before the date he had told me it was due by. Not only that at least 5 of the missing awards were one’s that I sent him months earlier before another awards meeting, where he didn’t get any of his awards at all. And I overhead the den leading saying that he’d had to run to the scout store that day to get a some other award that he’d forgotten. They also gave him a 1 year scouting pin instead of a 2 year pin. In my opinion there was no excuse for them not having his awards.
My son earned some awards between May and June and I never submitted them, because the message that I sent asking about them was never responded to. I am not sure if his Pack has spare stock or not. But I’ve been meaning to ask about rather I can go and purchase items he earned but didn’t receive including maybe ones that he earned over the summer after the “new” program was officially started but before our pack had any meetings. I would have liked the option for boys who were Scouts prior to the change to continue earning those belt loops and pins.
Although sadly I am becoming very disillusioned with the entire scouting program in our area. I have contacted multiple Packs this summer trying to find a new one that will hopefully fit our ideals better than this one has and not a single one has responded to my messages.
Did you ask the pack you are in if they plan on giving your son credit for the awards and if you purchase the awards on your own? It’s not ideal but at least your son will get them.
Have you tried contacting your district commissioner for help? That person should be able to help you with this issue. Also, I have heard that scout shops still have the old awards (most likely) in their inventory, they just are no longer displaying them. I do not think all the old awards went in the trash the moment the program changed…. If you do not know who your district commissioner is, contact BSA and they should be able to tell you. All leaders are registered through BSA, even those at the Pack level, like den leaders and cub masters.
WOW I am unclear here folks. First there is the spirit of scouting, so if any boys does his best then he should get credit for his attempts. However I read in the string a few items that concerns me. 1. He has not made many meeting for whatever reason, so the question is how can he be up to speed if he misses meetings? Maybe it is time to rethink scouting of it is taking second or third chair to other activities. 2. The comment that his den leader does not keep on him, WHY is it his den leader responsibility to get him from start to finish? Cub Scouting is a family program and requires parent participation, BSA is not Baby Sitters of America. As long as you email the den leader and ask for help he/she should be able to give you some guidance but it is not the den leaders responsibility to provide your son everything he needs, you must think outside the box. In my pack I have kids who achieve on their and some who just come for the fun, I have many who do not earn their ranks each year because of being too busy with other ball sports or activities and I explain that to the parents, some get pissed and some understand. We give tiger awards regardless but tell parents each year it becomes more challenging. I refuse to give away webelos badges and arrow of lights! You earn them or you don’t. As webelos we do not allow parents to just sign off, the boy has to have a cubmaster conference just like in boy scouts. FOLKS this new adventure program is a challenge for den leaders, so give them time. I for one after 42 years are having a heck of a time trying to mix adventures so my dens can work together in one activity. The stores have ALL the old awards until late next year, the ONLY old program that should be in use today is any webelos II scouts, your new webelos I scouts need to be on the new adventure program. So far they are kind of matching up.
@OldManScouty I see you have dedication to Scouting and rally to the defense of the leader which is understandable. If you noticed, I addressed the same concerns in what I believe was a more tactful way. By simply stating that as long as the Scout earned the achievement AND the leader signed off the issue of poor attendance was addressed. Remember that Scouts can have poor attendance for numerous reasons and it’s not only conflicts in schedules. There can be family traumas, health, and a multitude of other factors so firing back at a parent who is truly interested in keeping her child in the program really isn’t the answer.
Also, not every leader is as dedicated as you and I. It’s just that plain and simple. Some unfortunately don’t have the same drive and the fact remains it’s a volunteer position so parents are left often searching for the right fit. The great thing about Scouting is that if one unit isn’t for you, the option remains to find one that is.
Lastly, you are correct the new Program is vastly different and I did suggest that her son be working on his next rank but not ALL packs meet in the summer and some allow for Scouts who have fallen behind to catch up in the summer months before they start working on their new ranks.
Maybe you didn’t intend your post to sound as negative as it read but as a leader we represent the BSA as a whole and while we aren’t the Babysitters of America we are leaders and represent one of the oldest most honorable institutions in America. I hope that my words represent kindness and approachability so that others know they are always welcome here.
@Patti I second Jill’s sentiments about contacting your District. There are District Commissioners and District Executives (who can help you locate other pack leaders if you aren’t getting responses). Don’t let award issues make you disillusioned.
And as Jill stated the old awards are still going to be sold until out of stock in our area (likely throughout this year is what we were told).
Now different units do their awards differently so I can’t speak to your units policy but if a child earned an award they should receive recognition that is the fundamental idea behind the scouting program. The leader does have to sign off on the requirement to receive the award and as long as that happened there should be nothing blocking your Scout from being awarded his recognition.
I will say that each Scout year begins June 1 although individual units have different rules as to whether he should be working towards achievements from last year. In our unit this is not allowed except for a rare exception of rank requirement and a Scout can not work toward any of his next rank requirements until his last rank is received. Therefore in many units (not necessarily yours) he shouldn’t be working on former requirements (last year’s/ old Belt Loop or Pins) this summer because that is no longer active unless he is a second year Webelos as they can be grandfathered into the old program for this year.
Otherwise, all other boys are in the new books. This change over occurs even if your Pack doesn’t have summer meetings because many kids attend summer camps where they work on requirements towards their next rank. I bet that a new leader would make allowances (I would) and award him for his work but let you know that our policy is different if theirs varies from your last leaders policy.
I hope this helps. Best of luck in your son’s continued Scouting journey.
I should have made it clear that it wasn’t rank awards that my son was missing, (he got those along with the other boys in his den) it was belt loops and pins. All of them were ones that he worked on, on his own. HIs Pack is great, it’s his den leader with whom I have issues. He is a bare minimum type of scouter and I am the mom who grew up in a very active scouting family. My dad was an assistant scout master of an extremely active Pack. I remember being jealous because as Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts their pack met weekly and went on camping trips… My girl scout troop met once a month and Never went camping. Thankfully we got to go as a family and do most of the things the boys did. My brothers were always working on earning awards and not just going through the motions to achieve the next rank. Which is how I feel that this Den and the last one were. Both den leaders have given less than 48 hours notice of a den meeting. I was extremely upset when we missed one where I got notice the night before and I hadn’t checked my email for just over 24 hours so by the time I saw it we didn’t have time to get to the meeting that had already started. Some parents I know chastised me for not keeping up with my email when I know that I could miss something important like that. I don’t feel that I should have to be tied to my email for things that should be set at least a week in advance. Or better yet a month in advance so that I can plan my schedule around Scouting instead of having to make last minute changes so that my son doesn’t miss out. My dad did a better job of being a leader and he didn’t have the privilege of growing up in scouting. I know that at least one of my son’s den leaders was an Eagle Scout, goodness knows he mentioned it enough times. And maybe I expected too much from someone who put in that much work for himself. My son has already said that he aspires to be an Eagle Scout and continue my family’s tradition. (My Grandfather was an Eagle Scout way in the early days of scouting. My mom’s brother is an Eagle Scout and one of my 3 brothers is an Eagle.) He is enthusiastic and has been willing to put in the extra work to earn the belt loops on his own. Now it seems that he will be mostly stuck working at only what his Den leader chooses to do. I think the boys did 3 belt loops as a den and only once did we meet (as a den) for something that wasn’t required to earn their Wolf badges. To me that is bare minimum. And I’m guessing that we wouldn’t have met that one extra time if I hadn’t been pushing for more. I offered to lead meetings and to organize everything so that the boys could work on belt loops together with both dens that we were in. But in both cases my ideas were left to languish. I felt like it was a slap in the face from the den leaders for them to ask for our ideas and ways in which we were willing to help out only to have both respond to a question I asked but to not even respond to my offer in any way. Although the 2nd den leader did use my idea to go fishing and then do a clean up of the park to work on their community service award. Only he never mentioned that I had sent him the idea months before. And then after the boys fished for awhile he decided that he was too tired to do the clean up. And he didn’t want to have a cookout which would have made perfect sense given the timing. (We brought hot chocolate for the boys. But my husband’s offer to cook hot dogs was turned down.) I am not sure that it is related to leadership but I know that after my son’s tiger year at least 2 other families in our Den changed packs to other local packs. Not sure about this year as it hasn’t started yet. We were told that the pack has a summer pool party and another summer event but if they had one or plan one we haven’t gotten the message. Since we ended the year in early May the only thing we done with scouting is Summer Day Camp. I wish I’d had to money to send my son to the over night over too. I did offer the the first year to be the assistant den leader or even the den leader if no one else could do that. The reason I hesitated to be a den leader was that we usually leave Texas for at least 4 weeks in December to go to FL to visit my family and that I like to try and take at least one other family trip if I can find the money to do so and an awesome deal. (Which I haven’t been able to do since we started Scouts.) I naively thought that if I did that I would be short changing the boys by not having meetings during those times. As it turned out even though we were robbed last year and FL and it delayed our trip home by almost 2 weeks while we repaired our van and I got things replaced that were stolen we only missed 1 meeting. out of both years. And oddly the date for that one was sent out 2 days before the meeting, even though I’d sent our expected return date a week earlier it was set for the day before we returned. At that point I honestly felt like the den leader knew that I was not happy with him so he made sure to have a meeting that he knew would exclude Daniel. But maybe he is just that busy? Only when you lead a group that you are telling “Do your best!” You need to live by that motto when it comes to them.
I will keep trying to find the right fit for my son. I wish I could get some answers from some Packs around here, but it seems like no one answers messages. None of the packs have more than a cursory website, nor do they have a facebook page. (I offered to set up and manage a PRIVATE facebook page for our den, so that the boys could share what they were working on. Ideas for earning belt loops and pins. And just general scouting ideas or info that I came across. But that idea was shot down too.)
I am confident that I would be a valuable asset to right Pack. I just have find one like the one that my brothers and I grew up in. Where the boys have fun and are friends and buddies and not just someone they sit next to once a month or so. Here’s hoping that I find that this year.
@ Patti Again, I second my sentiments to speak to your District Executive. This information should be available on your council’s website. Also, if you have a local Scout store they certainly have the DE’s info. This person will have the contact info for all the local Packs. Unfortunately, as Packs are volunteer led I find that most websites are cursory even my Packs was poorly maintained and as I left I recommended a pre-formatted website so that we could correct that issue. We had a FB but only parents of current Scouts are accepted or would likely even know what name those search under. Most don’t have open public pages due to privacy for the children and possibility of posts about where the kids are at certain times. So web searching can be frustrating unless it’s through BeAScout.org which directly contacts Pack leaders and let’s them know there is an interested parent for their unit.
It sounds that your son is truly interested in Scouting and that’s a blessing for any leader. I find a pack that meets only once a month a bit frustrating as well. I also am not a fan of last minute communications unless there is a weather situation or other extenuating circumstance. Our Pack puts out its calendar 3-6 months in advance and den meetings are on set nights. So it is frustrating to get last minute communications. These are legitimate complaints and you should seek out a Pack with a better fit in these areas.
It sounds to me as though you would make a great active parent and/or leader in another Pack. You are full of ideas and have a history in Scouting. Let any Pack you meet with know your desire to see your son through his Scouting journey and to play an active role in his time in Scouting.
As far as a vacation holding you back from being a leader, don’t let that hold you back. Everyone has a life. There are assistant den leader roles. Your assistant could keep the kids going in your absence or you could choose to not meet while your on vacation and perhaps meet up a few extra times before or after dependent on parent availability. It’s normal for conflicts to arise and leaders make it work that’s what is great. But the dedicated leaders make it fun and bring lots of ideas to the table.
Again, much of luck to you as you reach out to other leaders. I’m not sure where you are or I’d find out who your DE is. But I bet you can find it with a few strokes of a keyboard. You may find a new pack by the end of the day ?
My is in response to Patti G. post on August 13, 2015
I too am an old school Eagle Scout as well as numerous other accolades in the O.A.’s who also made the time by prioritizing my many other responsibilities including family to become a (Den Leader) during my sons youth years and am now i am a Grandfather and am finding out once again my knowledge and services are once being requested.
The one thing i am hearing from Patti is the repeated (I) word. And am wondering who this adventure is for? I thought it was about the boys as a unit. Anyway from my reading of your post you are a very busy person. You might take in to account the time of the Den Leaders, Cub Master, Committee Members etc. who are all ( Volunteers) maybe just maybe you might try to form a DEN of your own? That way you can do things your way?
@Patti G. I read through a long string and I THINK I am hearing your son did not receive some belt loops or pins. I concur you can go to your council professional BUT quite frankly they are not going to be able to get them for you since it is a purchase the unit must acquire. Now if the awards were during a council event they should provide you proof. I can tell you from my pack we give a completion card for certain awards and belt loops and have the boy’s family buy them as the cost add up and most boys never wear them. I also run a cub scout day camp and we only gave out completion cards. Hey if you cannot find what you need because the store does not have it, message me I will be happy to share what I have since I seem to have a small store full, ha ha ha.
I say “I” because I can’t speak for other parents. None of them speak up or have shared what they want. Maybe they are happy with what is there or maybe they just don’t feel comfortable asking for more. I know the first pack I was with there were 6 or 7 boys in the den (some boys weren’t very active.) Out of the ones who went to most things 3 boys left the den and moved to other Packs. The assistant den leader left with his son “to join a pack that friend or cousin was in” The other boy’s dad didn’t say they were leaving when we were there but a few weeks after the new year started they ended up in the same new Pack we were in. So my guess would be that they wanted more but that the dad was too shy to speak up. We weren’t in a place that I could comfortably ask so I never got to.
But should the fact that other parents don’t care or maybe they don’t know that this isn’t all that is out there stop me from advocating for my son and maybe by proxy for them? For that matter is what I want less important because they don’t care one way or the other?
I inquired at the end of last year about the possibility of starting another Den. Only there aren’t enough boys and I’m guessing that it’s unlikely that enough will join since we only had 5 boys who attended on any sort of regular basis. And it wasn’t unusual to only have 4. I also offered to help in any way possible.
As of now I still have not succeeded in getting a response from a single Pack in our area. I sent several more messages out on Friday including another one to a pack that says they meet weekly and a second one to the number I was given for the area consul. I feel very frustrated that no one seems to follow up.
I do not have the money nor the knowledge to start up my pack. I also don’t plan to live in this area long enough (God willing) to put that much work into something when I should be able to find a Pack that works for us. As I stated early on I offered with the first Pack to be the Tiger den leader if they needed one. I also offered to be an assistant den leader when someone more enthusiastic stepped forward wanting to lead the den. With the new pack the Den was established and while there was no assistant den leader there was never any mention of adding one. I did offer repeatedly to help in any way possible including leading meetings.
I got a schedule on Saturday and at least this year there are actually den meetings scheduled. Although some are listed as “either the ?? or the ??” I’d say that 1/3 of the mostly monthly meetings have a note that they will be lead by the assistant den leader. There was also a message asking for someone to volunteer to be the assistant den leader. I sent what I think was a very nice note saying that I would volunteer for the position if others were interested in having a weekly den meeting like other local dens do. I said that I understand that frequent meetings are not for everyone but if the other parents wanted to work on things between the advancement meetings that I would love to do that. If no one was interested in doing that then I would search for another pack. Since I just sent it yesterday I haven’t received any answers. Although it’s possible that I won’t get any responses at all. If not “Oh well I did my best.” Wish me luck.
@ Patti I can understand your frustration about infrequent meetings and failure to announce the schedule in advance. I will say our Pack’s send meet twice a month (with Go Sees sometimes a third time) plus a Pack meeting once a month. In addition, we have regularly scheduled Pack events with generally a camp out/in once a month or some other major event.
It seems that if your Pack/ Den isn’t meeting regularly it would be practically impossible to complete the requirements for rank advancement under the new program.
I really can’t imagine why area Packs are so unresponsive. Perhaps there is a problem with the BeAScout system in your area. Did you contact your local District Executive? He/ she would have leader contact info. I wish you best of luck. I do think becoming a leader would advance your cause. Nothing like a vested interest in the Pack to gain a stake.
Patti, you should be able to simply transfer your son to another pack….find out from your local scout council where other packs in your area are meeting and just go visit a meeting, or ask for their cubmaster or committee chair contact info (if they will give it to you) and let those people know you are interested in attending a meeting. Our local council will inform our pack if a family is seeking a pack and we are the one associated with their elementary school or in their neighborhood. It is possible people aren’t getting the requests that you’ve sent or they have put it on a back burner, intending to get to it later. Don’t give up! You sound dedicated, and that will be good for a Pack.
I believe that we have found a new pack! It took me all summer and heaven knows how many phone calls, emails, and just asking around… A lot. When I noticed a 2nd number for one of the packs I had tried in the past I used it. (Don’t know if it was new or if I just missed it. But I don’t think it was the number under cubs.) I was thrilled when I was told that they meet weekly for most of the year. Bi-weekly during the summer. If the pack we have been with did any of the things they said they were going to do during the summer we weren’t notified. I have a schedule for meetings and events. And it has not 2 but 4 camping trips listed. Which means that we should easily be able to do at least 2 and hopefully more. I am very excited. We met the den last week and I liked them enough that I already told our old den that we are leaving. I think I’m just a little leery because it all sounds too good to be true. I just have to fill out the paperwork and turn it in. Get my son’s awards from his old pack and get moving forward. Their recruitment drive is the night their next meeting would been so we are attending that. I think though that my son might have already recruited his first scout. I haven’t told him since I don’t want him to be disappointed if it doesn’t work out. But over the summer he was telling a boy that he’s met a few times (the grandson of a friend of my husband’s) about scouting and he was really interested. His mom is a facebook friend of mine and when I posted about moving to a new pack she told me that she was considering letting him join. So I invited her to come. Fingers crossed. I know that D. Would love that.
Hey on another uniform note I assume that BSA acquired the rights to “Patch Magic” and now call it BadgeMagic. I wonder if it is still the same shotty product? Okay yeah it easy to use but it last one or two washings and when it peels back it looks like crud! When I was a wee cubby in 1970 our den mom was awesome and taught us how to sew them on, so I have done my own sewing for decades now, so happy I learned this life skill. Will never use patch magic or glue, makes scouting too easy, alway enjoy a challenge (like this new cub program) not the best but at least it matches up in the webelos program.
I am terrified by the new program. Wolf leader. Have we forgotten these are boys? Required scits? Scouting. Boys.. Program is lost. May have our 4 sons start as boyscouts. Very little boyscout related changes. 10 years of being a scout did not prepare me for this. “Traditions” that lifetime scouts/leaders have never heard of. I had fantastic leaders growing up, but this was designed by people who didn’t go through scouting as a scout, or think it would be “cute” to see these boys do things instead of focusing on helping them advance as scouts/men/citizens.
As a parent I am still learning about the new program. I am hoping it is not as bad as you describe. But some of what I read seems more in line with schoolwork, that scouting. An entire Adventure that seems to focus on coins? I don’t get how that ties into scouting. This year they have been told to learn about 2 famous Americans. It seems lame to have him do something that he is already doing in school, Oh and have a carnival? I’m not sure how any of those tie into scouting. There also seems to be more focus on religion. Hopefully his new Den will work on some of the electives. But I’m disappointed that at least 2 are close to the same ones that he earned under the old program and a couple that sound like a lot of fun he could only have earned as a Wolf except that he’s a Bear this year. I am really trying to like this new program, but I just feel like it’s a big let down. I am just praying that the new den leader is as good as I hope and takes the boys on an Adventure that they will remember. Maybe we could make that our Den motto: An Adventure to Remember!”